The problem I am having with any of this, is you over look all the problems with EU. The constant overlapping of ideas, and how nothing flowed together, and was really just written to be written and make money. Exactly what Disney is doing... Yet, now, all of a sudden, 30 years later, its a terrible idea and it should never happen?

I get the idea that your "attached" to an idea. I get that as a kid, this is what you imagined Luke may or may not do. But it doesn't make it canon, in fact, it never was canon. We just accepted it because we never thought we would get Episodes 1-9. Now that we are, you have to be open to the idea of its not going to happen the way you want.

I blame Millenials for crying all the time when they don't get things their way... And I am seeing now how some of them acquired this gene.

A problem for Disney is all the damage control they need to do after Lucas' episodes 6, 1, 2, 3. Like the completely unnecessary thing with Leia being Luke's sister that has no impact at all in the old movies other than allowing Leia and Han become a couple without 50 % of fans being upset that she did not choose Luke instead. Making a good space opera into Skywalker soap opera. And pretty much all of PT that just keeps making it increasingly worse. I think Disney has been doing a great job so far given what they had to work with, making the first really good things for (canon) Star Wars since 1980.

Lucas would 100 % have made Phasma his mother and turned the rest into soap opera as well, and we would have had a lot more scenes with people walking around in front of a green screen talking and then jump around in front of the same green screen doing acrobatics with light sabers.

The Prequels really aren't that bad, If you look at the actual plot and it's development throughout the movies it's actually pretty well done. Things like the distractingly heavy use of CGI and the love story of Anakin and Padme being forced are valid complaints, but other complaints about things that "you just don't like" (AKA Midichlorians) are really just superficial.

Leia does have a purpose being Luke's twin, Vader uses that knowledge to incite anger in Luke hoping to turn him to the dark side, and if not destroy him and turn her.

The problem with Disney's movies is they don't make sense, other than TFA which clearly went for the nostalgia play.

Rogue One, the one thing this movie really needed to do was setup the Empire as a great threat to the galaxy. Unfortunatley the only threats in the movie are the Death Star (well established as such in Episode 4), and Vader (Good Job on that one). Everything else about the Empire in that movie was complete garbage! It didn't feel like they were rebelling against an evil militant force and it's dictator, but rather throwing a fit because they just didn't like the way things were... and that absolutely pointless brain sucking monster was completely unnecessary and stupid beyond all hope.

TLJ... (I know my first issue is really just a superficial complaint, but the rest, well most of them anyway, stand firm)



The first 3 X-wing books
Courtship of Leia
The Han Solo Trilogy (rebel dawn I think was the third in the series)
The first couple Vong Books
The Trawn Trilogy
Phasma (the only one of the new stuff as I haven't been impressed enough to care, but I liked the potential Phasma had from TFA and was intrigued, only to be horribly let down)
The one that leads into the events of TPM (Cestus Deception I think)
Various of the comic series (if you want to count them)
I have the books from the Jacen and Jaina fiasco, but haven't sat down to read them yet.

A several of the scholastic ones that were ok that I can't remember the lines/names of off the top of my head, and probably a few other. (quite a random assortment)

We already knew he loved Leia and we already saw how Luke+Leia+Han and their friends cared for each other in general, all the danger they put each other through to save Han from Jabba, it would have worked just as well to make Luke mad without Leia, or Vader could just have used other threats. Throne room was definitely the height of the movie of course, but it did not need them to be siblings to be that.

The scenes in ROTJ establishing that Luke and Leia are siblings are extremely weak compared to the "I am your father" moment they obviously try to repeat, just mention it almost in passing, on level with the worst emotional scenes in the prequels. A movie with already way too many weak scenes and unnecessary sub-plots (and people complain about the casino in TLJ!) could really have done without that.

And in the prequels the fact that twins are born instead of just one kid adds again nothing other than that they had to do that because of that being an established fact from ROTJ. It was a great moment for Lucas to throw us a real surprise, revealing that they were in fact not siblings at all. I still think episode 3 was by far the best of the prequels, but almost only because of the order 66 scenes. Everything about Obi and Anakin and the emperor is pretty boring and predictable (not to mention the dated special effects, especially the lava planet... at least my kids got a good laugh watching that).

Bothers me that the good "I am your father" moment is turned into "this is just a silly soap opera and everyone is by coincidence related here" in the next movie, trying to shock the audience a second time. Not that I mind now how it ended up with Han+Leia in the new movies. Guess that kind of makes up for it, setting things up for Kylo like that.



I never even considered that as something that movie "needed to do". It was a good fun war adventure movie and good father+daughter movie. Maybe it would have been even better in the earlier form before they cut it to be more family friendly (will we ever see a director's cut?).

The prequels are bad, especially Attack of the Clones and Phantom Menace. It is the script that is terrible.
Jar Jar is unforgivable, absolute garbage. On more than one level. If they had just left him on the ship while on Tatooine it would have been alright, but all the just worthless and infuriating scenes with his tongue on things and running into the Dug and getting his tongue numbed are just awful and take away from awesome Qui-Gon.

Anakin "Are you an angel" and than when he was piloting the ship?!?!?!?!?!? "Whoa!"
it was so bad.
Padme was not any better.
Midichlorian was a bad idea from the start. Just have Qui-Gon sense in the force Anakin's power and that is way way better.
The problem is the acting what that kid, just bad bad bad.
They made very little connection between the lessons Yoda taught and the actions of Anakin.
"Afraid to lose your mother"

"what does that have to do with anything?"
"EVEYRTHING, fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering"

what a friggin lesson. he gets another lesson from Yoda further on which is GREAT stuff. Than Hayden does a great job with the scene with the Sand People that killed his mother. just fantastic! but it was ruined by Padme... who was just bad bad bad.


So the connections between the movies are better imo, but ONLY because we already know what is happening and what is going to happen and what has to happen.

With Last Jedi we do not know what has happened, what is going to happen at all, we have no story to base it off of.
We have nothing. But there is nothing in the Last Jedi that cannot be explained by something, one of the main reasons for that is that there is nothing there to disprove it.

But Rogue One did not need to completely make the Empire this terribly awful organization that has already been done. That is being done in the Rebels TV show. Also Tarkin was very very menacing and powerful in the movie.
Rogue One put a microscope on the huge universe and focused it onto a few characters. which was fun and made Orson bigger than he actually was.

But the rebellion was already on (and it was already going on in Rebels that pre-dates R1). If they ever need to establish just how evil the Empire is they can do that in some new prequel later. I never even considered that doing that would have been important for R1. The rebellion was already a fact for whatever reasons. Everyone always accepted that when watching the OT anyway even if there was little actual on-screen evidence that the empire was the evil side (mostly that they dressed in black and Vader had a scary voice).

I agree with you that the stroy is better paced and even spelled out. But like I said they are prequels and we already knew what was going to happen. It makes the story already better because we know how everything is going to go.

There is always this complaint that TLJ takes a dump on FA. Well that is a tiny bit true.
but, for me, who cares? FA as garbage imo and created a TON of problems.

#1 problem, what to do with Finn the weanie? What to do with Phasma the weak minded? what to do with Snoke? what to do with Luke?

If Abrams gave Luke a few minutes of introduction it would have helped tremendously.
I mean, think about it.
Force Awakens gives NO answers to anything. Not a single thing. It is all left for Johnson. Phasma, no back story, no action, nothing.
Snoke, no backstory, no action, nothing
Kylo, no backstory, little action
Rey, no backstory, Mary Sue
Luke, NOTHING at all
Poe, no backstory
Finn, tiny backstory, set him up as a coward.

Abrams did nothing that everyone wanted Johnson to do and they do not fault him for his terrible story telling.

Everyone should be thanking Johnson for getting rid of some of those issues so that the final movie has somewhere to go and can conclude without being a 6 hour long movie.

If Snoke was alive, if Luke was alive, if Kylo wasn't the leader, if Rey didn't grow into the "last jedi", if Phasma was still around, etc. than the final movie could not focus the way it needs to.
If I was Johnson I would have left Phasma in a trash compactor and Finn in a coma and not dealt with them at all.


It was not a movie about starting a rebellion. The rebellion was in full force, the Death Star was making them think it was not worth continuing the rebellion. It was a rebellion within the rebellion. the "Rogues" were reblling against Dodonna and others of the already established rebellion.
The Empire was already seen as a devastating threat in the movie and in the Rebels tv show.

what inconsistencies?

right, there were way too many characters to develop BECAUSE abrams did nothing to develop a single character other than Han Solo's death helping define him. Literally that is all we got. No answer on who Rey was, Poe was, how Kylo fell, who Snoke was, etc.
The other thing is that if you look at the originals it only focused on a few people.
Luke, Leia, and Han.

Vader was barely in any of the films. He had no backstory, no explanation, no anything. People Loved it and love it now. Sometimes not knowing is great.
Tarkin died in A New Hope, people didn't whine and complain and they still don't.
There is no back story, no explanation for why he didn't evacuate the Death Star or anything. There is no explanation for the Emperor, how he came to power, etc. everyone loved him and still love him in those movies. He is just there.


FACT is that Abrams brought in too many characters. If Poe is the character that is going somewhere then there is little time for Finn, Kylo, Luke, Rey, Snoke, Phasma, Hux are all big screen time characters because of Abrams.

I am so happy that a lot of them were killed off so we can have that "Magnifying glass" focus of the originals for the final chapter of the trilogy.

From FA

Kylo is Vader
Rey is Luke
Hux is Tarkin
Chewie is Chewie
BB-8 is R2
Jabba the Hutt is Unkarr
Han Solo is Obi-Wan Kenobi
Leia is Leia

Finn is??? Han Solo I guess.. but he sucks and there is already Han
Snoke is??? Emperor I assume even though we don't see the emperor in A New Hope
Maz Kanata is???
Phasma is???


See what I mean? just too many people going on. and on top of that each of those gets more pushed in screen time.R2 had practical roles, Jabba the Hutt was there for 1 minute, Obi-Wan died early which freed up time, Kylo is much much more prevalent than Vader, than there are 3 more characters to worry about that are brought in: Snoke, Maz Kanata, and Phasma.

The amount of people is way too much, Abrams made it Avenger level amount of people to take care of. Johnson had to bring it back to good story telling levels.


They did destroy a whole huge town with the newly developed Death Star and that newly developed Death Star MADE THE REBELLION DECIDE TO GIVE UP
I dont know how much more menacing/intimidating you can be than to make a group give up completely. A group that had been working for years to build a rebellion. I mean everything that the Rebels TV show is happened to stop the Empire and they were going to give all that up?!

A little perspective shows that the movie put the Empire in a very light that had yet to be seen before.

Here's a hypothetical conversation between person 1 and person 2.

1 "Tell me why you like this"

2 "I like it because of this, that and the other thing"

1 "You can't like it because of that. I don't understand that. Gotta be something else"

2 "Nope, like it because of that. It's how this thing called liking works. Different people like different things and they can like them for different reasons with varying degrees of intensity."

1 "Hmmm. That's wrong. The explanation is that you (and your parents) are whiners."


Boy is that some sound reasoning.

I blame stupid people. (and their parents)

Person 1-I hate the DU b/c its not consistent and the plot is bad

Person 2 - What great plot did you love in the OT?

Person 1 Its all the books in the EU! So much depth and its all so awesome!

Person 2 - Have you read anything from the DU to help you understand the new universe?

Person 1 - No! I hate it! I will never give it a chance.

Person 2 - You are crying Millenial baby.