RegisterDonateLogin

No Youngling's lunchbox should be without it.

Welcome Guest Active Topics | Members

V-Set 16 Spoiler Thread Options
droidadmiral
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 12:53:13 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/20/2010
Posts: 172
jen'ari wrote:
adamb0nd wrote:
Not sure that's what thehutt was doing. Seemed more like he was trying to keep any new players from fleeing in fear of frustration between the community and designers in this thread. As far as I can tell, the answer to the concerns with Reylo is:

"We see your complaints, we'll have designers keep this complaint in mind moving forward".

I'm not sure what better or other response you could hope for this late in the design process.


I made the complaints during the design process, they didn't care. They didn't want to "keep it in mind" they actually mock those that care about theme.

and I quote darkdracul

"Hey, feel free to blame me if anyone gets their panties in a bunch over it. It's not like I've never been accused of being a crappy designer for putting good game mechanics over theme. Lol"

They knew that it was not thematic while designing it. They had discussions about how to spin it so that they could explain it. Which is why darkdracul had a quick long explanation, it was pre-made.





Bomb Bomb Bomb Bomb Bomb

Well....there's that I guess Adamb0nd
droidadmiral
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 1:10:01 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/20/2010
Posts: 172
shmi15
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 2:08:12 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/19/2010
Posts: 1,290
And the plot thickens... A designer admiting behind closed doors it's not thematic... Someone spoke up about it during design and were ignored, because.... A designer wanted to make a piece the way they want? And by the way, please, tell anyone who is not familiar with the game, but is familiar with Star Wars, they can play a resistance squad with Kylo. Or a first order squad with Rey. See how they feel about it.
adamb0nd
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 2:24:11 PM
Rank: Moderator
Groups: Member , Moderator

Joined: 9/16/2008
Posts: 2,281
droidadmiral wrote:


Well....there's that I guess Adamb0nd


DarkDracul
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 4:05:52 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/18/2008
Posts: 1,047
Location: Kokomo
Why wouldn't you want to represent the most epic scene from TLJ?!
Yeah, it's going to get weird . . . some people might not like it.
This design team voted it worth doing.

adamb0nd wrote:
"We see your complaints, we'll have designers keep this complaint in mind moving forward".
This is absolutely true. ReyLo is a cool idea that flirted with a line designers may want to avoid in the future.

Yes, we invited Jen’ari into our private design forum to help us with suggestions and playtesting.
He made complaints about ReyLo during the design process and our design team discussed them.
Yes, we were fully aware that ReyLo would not be well received by everyone.
I agreed to take on the task of sharing designer’s thought process with the community.
It’s also true that I put enjoyable gameplay over pretty looking cards.

Jen’ari taking my comments from our private forum and posting them publicly here was a shallow move.
We've tried to work with him but he’s too immature to behave like a decent human being.
I have zero respect for him or the venom he spews. He’s singlehandedly more damaging to this game than anything the v-set designers could ever do.

jen'ari wrote:
I 100% understand the NEED for acrobatics. Master Thon needs it too.

Therein lies the rub, theme manifests through various aspects of the game. It could be having the objectively literal Crowd Fighting on the card. It could be having the subjectively abstracted concept that a character is difficult to pin down in gameplay.

What happens when the objectively literal Crowd Fighting does not match our subjective expectations for a difficult to pin down character in gameplay? The essence of that character is lost and no longer feels thematic when played; despite having “appropriately” labeled abilities.

A card that looks thematically correct but doesn’t feel like the character when you play it is fine if you just want a pretty card to look at. A card that looks inaccurate but feels like the character thematically when you play it is a small price for enjoyable gameplay. IMHO

ReyLo was constantly getting pinned down and easily killed in playtesting.
It sucked big time so we went with Acrobatic instead.
I thought players would want enjoyable gameplay over a pretty looking card.

Also, Acrobatics doesn’t need to be limited to high jumps and gymnastic flips.
I mean, for some people tying their shoes is an acrobatic feat.
Acrobatics from the original Greek term means, “walk on tiptoe, strut.”
In game terms, Acrobatics just means you can avoid enemies while moving.
This ReyLo is just dancing and pivioting around the enemy.

droidadmiral wrote:
its not all bad though designers... hermit obi is cool and Anakin should be a lot of fun. Canderous may make sith playable. I do look forward to some of the other names

Awesome dude! We’ll be doing 3 more spoilers (first thing) tonight on SHNN podcast @10pmEST.
One looks very strong competitively, could it be Balance Commitee material?. . . let’s find out!
(724) 444-7444 Call ID: 63807
http://www.talkshoe.com/talkshoe/web/talkCast.jsp?masterId=63807&cmd=tc
droidadmiral
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 4:55:54 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/20/2010
Posts: 172
Lol. Jen'ari you are like that Edward snowden guy trying to bring to light the darkness going on and you get attacked and your integrity questioned lol. I love it. He legitimately laughed at the people they knew would have problems with this and then are angry when that story comes to light... and accuse you of throwing venom?! I feel like I am taking crazy pills over here. I hope this isnt a thing that happens alot but clearly they designed for their own purposes accuracy and play groups be danged.


Oh well I wonder what the next previews will bring to light... I really hope it is as fun as this one has been lol
jen'ari
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 6:11:23 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 5/3/2014
Posts: 2,098
No DarkDracul, lying to the public while saying other things in private is shallow. Mocking those that enjoy the game for a particular reason different from yours is shallow

"With great power comes great responsibility"

The child is not the one "raging out" it is the one putting up a front to the community knowing that they will support you no matter what.
No matter if you are a liar or two-faced.

Am I sorry I took your private conversation public? Why the heck would i be? They are your words. You have been embarassed in front of everybody again, but everyone will just turn a shoulder and say "meh, it is jen'ari".

You would think that after all the conspiracies I have uncovered, all the pressure I have applied for good designing, all the secret combinations I have brought to light that I would, at the very least, be thought of as an anti-hero by some.

So I take the Snowden comment as a compliment.

What is this "tried to work with him" stuff?

I worked on set 15 with ZERO problems at all. ZERO, did a great job too, I was proud of that work. I love those pieces a lot. I love the pieces on 16 that I worked with as well I am glad that some of them look very similar to what they were.

The person in charge of Set 15 is someone who conducts himself with respect so he was given respect. Set 16 we had a designer post a stat block that was so crazy I thought surely the other designers would shoot it down..... it got passed for Play testing.... I fought and fought for people to reconsider. No one even thought to reconsider. HAHA! than I find out that I was 100% RIGHT the whole time! (like usual).

So ya, in the words of Natsu I got "fired up" and tried to get it changed, but no one cared they saw "venom" where there was actually reason and everyone protects everyone so why would I want to stay?
I was right too, there is not a single person that was there that can say that what I said was wrong. not a single person can look back at that first stat block and say that it should have been passed for Play-testing because if they did they would be silly and absurd after everything that was taken off of it in the last hour. hahaha
"We tried to work with him" no you didn't FlyingArrow did and I am sure he has sworn me off by now, but we worked flawlessly because he had ears to hear and when I said something he acknowledged it in some way or other and he didnt allow crazy things to come out and he did so in a respectful manner to the other designers. You never heard him "put his foot down, he didn't have to, he was a leader and people followed". You know, he was being a human being.

So don't sit here and try to paint me as this bad guy. You are the one saying one thing to the public while privately mocking them in your elitist estate on the "v-set team".
Go soak your head in someone's lap so you can feel better.
I hope you found a person to take that designer spot no one wants. I also hope that you respect Spryguy enough to let him join you on "Mt. Olympus" and design or are you going to keep stringing him along like a pet?
Quite frankly some of the things you (and v-set team) do are just horrifying. and it is horrifying that others support you in it or protect you when you are "caught"
adamb0nd
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 6:36:21 PM
Rank: Moderator
Groups: Member , Moderator

Joined: 9/16/2008
Posts: 2,281
The distinction between the card-theme accuracy and play-theme accuracy is true. That's why there are cards like han and proxy with their force points, or the ability to grant Luke and Han "Ewok". It seems that with every theme capturing mechanic introduced, theme-sacrificing interactions become more likely to occur. Han being blasted by Jedi hunter starts to make those "lucky rerolls" feel a lot less cool. By the time you get to the bottom of the list, there are more interactions with hans force point that feel wrong than feel right.

Reylo introduces a lot of those interactions that make me just hand wave away my imagination. That may not be important to you, but as a player, I appreciate designs that make an effort for theme. This game has never been particularly accurate, but I do prefer things like rival or synergy. Other players may love the mixing and matching of unlikely characters. The sith faction spans characters from across thousands of years, so, I don't really know where you draw that line. I can just explain my preference.

General_Grievous
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 6:53:05 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 1/8/2010
Posts: 3,623
DarkDracul
Posted: Thursday, July 12, 2018 9:55:52 PM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/18/2008
Posts: 1,047
Location: Kokomo
Added:07/13/18
Caleb Dume, Jedi Padawan 13/30
Jaina Solo Fel, Jedi Master 23/30
Admiral Raddus 16/30
droidadmiral
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 5:11:30 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/20/2010
Posts: 172
interesting new pieces will have to look at squad building option for them right now...

Quick question---- does battering charge work with strafe?
adamb0nd
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 5:22:25 AM
Rank: Moderator
Groups: Member , Moderator

Joined: 9/16/2008
Posts: 2,281
I really like that CE on Raddus. Can't process how to build to it yet, but it sounds really cool. I don't really know the character. Is there a story behind the inspiration for the CE?

Edit: oooh, i think he's the hammer head guy
shmi15
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 6:08:30 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/19/2010
Posts: 1,290
Admiral Raddus 16/30
Rebel - RM: Admiral Ackbar, UH43
Cost 11
HP 50
Def 15
Atk +5
Dam 10
Special Abilities
Unique. Pilot
Tactician +4 [Add +4 to the initiative roll except on a roll of 1]
Commander Effect
Droids are subject to this effect:
At the end of this character's turn choose 1 Rebel pilot follower within 6 squares. Until the end of this character's next turn, that follower gains Battering Assault +10 [Replaces turn: This character can move up to double speed, then attack each adjacent target once at +10 Damage. Determine legal targets before making the first attack roll. Huge or smaller characters hit by this attack are pushed back 2 squares from this character. This movement does not provoke attacks of opportunity.].
"Call up a Hammerhead Corvette, I have an idea."


Very interesting character.... Seems pretty aggressively costed in a faction thats full of aggressively costed Commanders.

Does the bolded phrase prevent a "lawnmower effect", to where you can only BC people you end your movement to?

DroidAdmiral does bring up a good point about Strafe tho... I would assume this does work with strafe, and I think you can give Leia/Luke Pilot someway correct? I know you can give most Luke's Pilot, just curious.

I dunno how I feel about something like this. I feel like this is a remake of the Imp's Non unique swarm without the Prideful... And we all know how that went, lol.

I don't think this is as powerful, because no prideful. How swarmy were playtests with this piece? I would assume you either Beef up a Luke, or to just swarm an opponent using Dodonna to set it all up.

I can see it now tho... A 6 point Rebel Pilot pushing a 50 point Jedi into a pit, thus ending their life.

I don't hate it. I don't like it. Were any playtests ran with the 29 point piece who makes all charactes count as rebel? to see what kind of Fringe Pilots benefit from all this?

Very very curious to see what playtests were ran, and what they were played against.

shmi15
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 6:09:56 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/19/2010
Posts: 1,290
Also, I am not familiar with the Jaina Solo/Fel piece... But given she is a Fel, why does she not have any affinity, or anything with Roan Fel? I assume thats where her marriage came in or something?

Like I said, I don't know much about that story arc.
droidadmiral
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 6:48:39 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/20/2010
Posts: 172
I believe jaina was jagged fel correct?
adamb0nd
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 6:49:49 AM
Rank: Moderator
Groups: Member , Moderator

Joined: 9/16/2008
Posts: 2,281
shmi15 wrote:
Also, I am not familiar with the Jaina Solo/Fel piece... But given she is a Fel, why does she not have any affinity, or anything with Roan Fel? I assume thats where her marriage came in or something?

Like I said, I don't know much about that story arc.


Not Roan Fel, but Jagged Fel from the Imperial faction. I don't remember if her and fel ever were officially married. Maybe that was eventually written. I *thought* it was only strongly implied because Star Wars Legecy had Emperor Roan Fel, a story that takes place 100 or so years after Return of the Jedi. It was implied that Roan Fel's family was force sensitive because of Jaina, and it explained why these force using Fels were in charge of the empire. I believe the stories with Jaina were left off with her and Jagged working together closely.


I also *think* there is a way to bring Jagged into the new republic faction. I cant remember if that's true or what piece does it. (edit: lol... that piece is Jagged fel. he has affinity).
General_Grievous
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 7:40:23 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 1/8/2010
Posts: 3,623
Can I say it warms a special place of my heart to see the legends characters come out alongside the new ones like Raddus. That will always be the Star Wars I grew up with and knew and while I find things to enjoy about the new movies/Rebels. The classic stories I'll always remember and it's awesome that SWM is probably one of the only if not the only place these characters will exist in gaming. Long live the old EU and thank you designers!
DarkDracul
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 11:18:16 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/18/2008
Posts: 1,047
Location: Kokomo
droidadmiral wrote:
interesting new pieces will have to look at squad building option for them right now...

Quick question---- does battering charge work with strafe?

No. You cannot use strafe with a Replaces Turn ability.

FAQ:
Strafe Attack
Q: I'm confused about how Strafe Attack and Accelerate interact for the Commando on Speeder Bike or the Scout Trooper on Speeder Bike. How far can those characters move while using Strafe Attack?
A: They can do any of the following things:
• Make a normal attack and then move up to 6 squares (using Strafe Attack, if applicable).
• Move up to 6 squares (using Strafe Attack, if applicable) and then make a normal attack.
• Move up to 12 squares using Strafe Attack
• Move up to 24 squares without attacking or using Strafe Attack.
DarkDracul
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 11:21:13 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 4/18/2008
Posts: 1,047
Location: Kokomo
adamb0nd wrote:
I really like that CE on Raddus. Can't process how to build to it yet, but it sounds really cool. I don't really know the character. Is there a story behind the inspiration for the CE?

Edit: oooh, i think he's the hammer head guy

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Raddus

droidadmiral
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 11:30:45 AM
Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member

Joined: 6/20/2010
Posts: 172
DarkDracul wrote:
droidadmiral wrote:
interesting new pieces will have to look at squad building option for them right now...

Quick question---- does battering charge work with strafe?

No. You cannot use strafe with a Replaces Turn ability.

FAQ:
Strafe Attack
Q: I'm confused about how Strafe Attack and Accelerate interact for the Commando on Speeder Bike or the Scout Trooper on Speeder Bike. How far can those characters move while using Strafe Attack?
A: They can do any of the following things:
• Make a normal attack and then move up to 6 squares (using Strafe Attack, if applicable).
• Move up to 6 squares (using Strafe Attack, if applicable) and then make a normal attack.
• Move up to 12 squares using Strafe Attack
• Move up to 24 squares without attacking or using Strafe Attack.
\



sweet, thanks!
Users browsing this topic
Guest


Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Main Forum RSS : RSS

Bloo Milk Theme Created by shinja
Powered by Yet Another Forum.net.
Copyright © 2003-2006 Yet Another Forum.net. All rights reserved.