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jen'ari
Posted: Friday, June 14, 2019 9:47:34 PM
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gandalfthegreatestwizard wrote:
The new Satele isn't as reliant on going first. She can do all of her 12 square move/attacks on her own turn instead of having to Intuition, which can leave old Satele vulnerable in the open. This Satele has more synergy with the Wookiee Commander since she gets two extra attacks instead of one, as well as playing better with Kao Cen Darach who gives her Flurry. She can fit into an Arkanian Jedi General squad to provide some melee/auto-dmg. Old Satele is really good, obviously, but I think there are reasons to play Hero of Alderaan too. Not every mini has to be tier 1 straight away- maybe she'll get another boost later on.

How can she move 12 and get two attacks off on her own?
Kao cen is tier 2.
The Arkanian Jedi General is a possible selling point. Need to look into that.

"Not every mini has to be tier 1"
I just think that some should be. I don't see any tier 1 pieces in the last 3 sets.
gandalfthegreatestwizard
Posted: Friday, June 14, 2019 10:02:39 PM
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Force Dash replaces attacks. So she can move 6 and then use Force Dash to move 6 more and make 2 attacks.
jen'ari
Posted: Saturday, June 15, 2019 5:20:31 AM
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Oh that is cool. Never used it.
That changes things a bit.
Still using a lot of force to do it. But with revan, in a phase, she can move 18 and deal 60 damage. That's pretty great with her other tricks.
Hmmm.. I still don't think it is enough to warrant playing her. Vima already fits that roll with Sokan and Charging. And old Satele is still so powerful it is not worth giving up Satele when there is someonethat already does the deep strike of new Satele available. Even if new satele is better then vima.
gandalfthegreatestwizard
Posted: Thursday, June 20, 2019 8:58:18 PM
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Post updated: Black Squadron Pilot and Black Krrsantan
DarkDracul
Posted: Thursday, June 27, 2019 12:53:08 PM
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gandalfthegreatestwizard
Posted: Thursday, June 27, 2019 6:32:29 PM
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Post updated: Neimoidians at Central Control Computer, Danni Quee and Dao Stryver
FlyingArrow
Posted: Saturday, June 29, 2019 8:42:28 AM
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Dao Stryver doesn't activate enemies. I just mention it because SHNN said she did. Just wanted to clarify.
urbanjedi
Posted: Sunday, June 30, 2019 3:30:25 AM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
Dao Stryver doesn't activate enemies. I just mention it because SHNN said she did. Just wanted to clarify.


oops, misread the ability.
General_Grievous
Posted: Sunday, June 30, 2019 3:16:52 PM
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Some big reveals here, the Central Computer is interesting but seems a bit clunky, also the standard twin attack isn't the most exciting. But perhaps I can try it with the huges or swarm. I'll definitley experiment with it haha.

Danni Quee on the other hand is a major character but a pretty hard counter to the Vong in general and for cheap and effective enough that she can be brought along with many NR squads. Her cost might also make Garm into a major player being able to potentially bring in a piece that can shut down a faction pretty solidly. I think just having Vong-sense and force sense 3 is enough without the other two SAs. Or just having one of them. But Yammosk and Super Stealth are the two cores of the entire faction, so that I find a bit much.
gandalfthegreatestwizard
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 1:52:40 AM
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I doubt that Danni will end up in many squads. Against anything other than the Yuuzhan Vong, she usually won't be worth her cost, so unless you think lots of people will be playing Vong at a tournament, or just really hate the Vong, you'll probably spend the points on something else. Garm isn't that great- if he does improve with some more Reinforcements options, then Danni might be a problem.

One of the guys on SHNN had a good point in that the New Republic should be good against the Vong. They won the war, after all.
jen'ari
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 4:34:06 AM
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Its always difficult when a powerful counter to a faction comes out... But vong sucks and the "jammer" is a real thing. So... I am down with it.
NR now has faith in the force and Danni. I would certainly be secretive about my gencon squad haha.
If memory serves correctly jammers work on a gravitation spectrum and different yammosk worked on different spectrums. Meaning a jammer only worked on one..... But in swm you can only bring in one yammosk..
I can't see a super strong place her. Maybe a lando pilot squad? Gregarious helping the low attack rating?
adamb0nd
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 4:38:08 AM
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Conceptually, I really like the Neimoidians at Central Control Computer. But it seems somewhat like a death trap for the primary purpose of it's design. The fact that it destroys battle droids en masse if defeated is thematic, but an insane gamble, especially when the unit requires LOS to benefit those followers. I'm not sure I see that this is any better than BDO + Worm + some mice. I am guessing CE disruption seriously prevents droid swarms, and this is an answer to that issue, but there are plenty of other swarm counters that exist (an may be more prevalent... strafe/gallop?) that this doesn't address and will still fall hard to.

Can I ask if anyone knows the logic for savage characters being impacted by the CE too? Why the LOS requirment? They're sitting on remote computers in mission control. They should be able to see their allies on the little monitor without having to swivel and look over their shoulder from their office chair.

urbanjedi
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 10:14:53 AM
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adamb0nd wrote:


Why the LOS requirment? They're sitting on remote computers in mission control. They should be able to see their allies on the little monitor without having to swivel and look over their shoulder from their office chair.



Not a designer on this set, but it would presumably be for game play interactions. No one really likes when their opp has a bunch of hid in the back commanders. This guy has to be somewhere he can see stuff. Also, in general if something has to have LOS or be out front where the enemy can get to it, it can be a little bit more powerful.

As we discussed on the SHNN, this guy is whorm, gha, and a BDO for fewer pts than those 3 combined.
gholli69
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 12:07:50 PM
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Also the fact that it has 160 HP makes for an interesting question for your opponent, do they go hard after the CCC and try to nerf your squad when it dies, or do they just ignore it and try to defeat the rest of the squad while the benefits are on. If you go after them, you likely take a whole round d worth of damage from the rest of the squad while trying to kill it likely to your main attacker, or you put up with more damage for a longer duration but probably more evenly spread out on your assets.
AceAce
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 2:10:45 PM
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PT this for this set. I ran Lancers and Sidious and it was fun. The opponent had to make a run for them as they will just eat gambit otherwise. It was a race between us to take and hold the center. Different game mechanic.
General_Grievous
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 9:30:28 PM
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I just don't like hard faction counters, even thematic ones Gandalf. Rebels shouldn't have a "disrupt all Imperial Commander effects in play", or Old Republic a "Sith characters cannot gain force points and Mandalorians cannot gain Twin attack".

A cheap reinforcements-able piece that is an auto-win against pretty much every Vong squad is pretty overpowered/NPE for Vong players. She is still helpful in a situation where she doesn't take on Vong or just being Garm and you have a win button against any Vong players. Normal faction hate is like "+4 and +10 Against fringe characters" or Ysalmari against some of the more force-heavy factions. But super Stealth and Yammosk are the two pillars of the Vong. Take that away and their non-unique CEs and what's left? And if anything at all is left after that, does narrowing their competive options improve the game or just create a new problem to be solved? Anyways I didn't PT on this one so I can't say too much but I really don't like her and what she represents in the game and I'll leave it at that. Perhaps I am in the majority in my thoughts on multipe hard counters on a cheap piece.

As for the Control Computer it is... interesting. I still think it will go down pretty quick in the heavy damage meta of today but at least it's another option in their tool box to try to help diversify the Separatist competitive squad types. It's clunky but I like pieces that bring new things up instead of crushing vast swaths of things down.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Monday, July 1, 2019 9:59:47 PM
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Eighth Cortex is the new hotness for Vong. It doesn't necessarily need a Yammosk and it runs mostly Uniques. The NU CE disruption is a weaker form of Disruptive. The Yammosk still steals a CE, it's just range 6 (if it was range 6 for the original squad). Vong player would need Relay Orders, or would need to place the Yammosk up far enough to make the CE useful (and possibly make the the Yammosk vulnerable).
General_Grievous
Posted: Tuesday, July 2, 2019 6:22:40 AM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
Eighth Cortex is the new hotness for Vong. It doesn't necessarily need a Yammosk and it runs mostly Uniques. The NU CE disruption is a weaker form of Disruptive. The Yammosk still steals a CE, it's just range 6 (if it was range 6 for the original squad). Vong player would need Relay Orders, or would need to place the Yammosk up far enough to make the CE useful (and possibly make the the Yammosk vulnerable).


But with a global disruption on rangeless shaper/scarification then those unique allies with the 8th Cortex are definitely going to be hampered offensively especially since the entire Vong faction is balanced around 10 base damage. Almost everything in the Vong faction needs a Yammosk. There is a reason no one ran anything but Nom Bombs in the WOTC era (and this piece also shuts down that squad type as well), the Yammosk fixed that to help the shapers and priests and now by destroying that with a cheap hard counter it's essentially ended the faction. Would anyone seriously run any Vong in a tournament knowing this piece exists? Is there as hard of a counter to any other one faction?

And why would you pay points for a Yammosk if it's not going to do anything anymore? The stealing a CE was the occasional extra icing but usually Commander effects are so specific these days that it's not helpful. So for the points of a Yammosk (which is an incredibly fragile literally huge target) you can bring equally fragile shapers/priests and have the same problem with all of them.

Blast bugs I get, but to so aggressively take out an entire factions identity with a cheap reinforcements piece is a bit much.
Caedus
Posted: Tuesday, July 2, 2019 7:21:06 AM
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General_Grievous wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
Eighth Cortex is the new hotness for Vong. It doesn't necessarily need a Yammosk and it runs mostly Uniques. The NU CE disruption is a weaker form of Disruptive. The Yammosk still steals a CE, it's just range 6 (if it was range 6 for the original squad). Vong player would need Relay Orders, or would need to place the Yammosk up far enough to make the CE useful (and possibly make the the Yammosk vulnerable).


But with a global disruption on rangeless shaper/scarification then those unique allies with the 8th Cortex are definitely going to be hampered offensively especially since the entire Vong faction is balanced around 10 base damage. Almost everything in the Vong faction needs a Yammosk. There is a reason no one ran anything but Nom Bombs in the WOTC era (and this piece also shuts down that squad type as well), the Yammosk fixed that to help the shapers and priests and now by destroying that with a cheap hard counter it's essentially ended the faction. Would anyone seriously run any Vong in a tournament knowing this piece exists? Is there as hard of a counter to any other one faction?

And why would you pay points for a Yammosk if it's not going to do anything anymore? The stealing a CE was the occasional extra icing but usually Commander effects are so specific these days that it's not helpful. So for the points of a Yammosk (which is an incredibly fragile literally huge target) you can bring equally fragile shapers/priests and have the same problem with all of them.

Blast bugs I get, but to so aggressively take out an entire factions identity with a cheap reinforcements piece is a bit much.



As a Vong Player, I would like to weigh in on this, however, I am at work. I will comment further on my lunch. See you in a bit.
Caedus
Posted: Tuesday, July 2, 2019 10:11:50 AM
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So let me start off by saying that this is one of the best pieces I have seen in a long time. Cost, Flavor, Game mechanics, all awesome. Now as far as her power level, it is good but there are ways around her. Mainline a squib give a Dovin Basal Keeper relay orders, back in business. Yes you lose 10 points of damage, but now everything else is back online. She only has 60 HP. So if anyone get to her she is toast. On an open map she is dangerous because she can stay in the back enough to disrupt, but if you have a lot of rooms on the map she has to get in the action, making her vulnerable. Remember the Yammosk ability is only affected if she can see them.
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