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tie breakers Options
Chargers
Posted: Wednesday, February 16, 2022 8:26:57 AM
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What is the current order of tie breakers?

It's changed over the years, and I've lost track of what the current process is.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Wednesday, February 16, 2022 9:06:24 AM
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For a tournament or an individual game?
kobayashimaru
Posted: Wednesday, February 16, 2022 6:53:21 PM
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I'm always interested to see reminders/refreshers on this
especially in the post-COVy era with venue hire being a whole different thing in many locales.

the "Floor Official" DCI order of stuff?
Victory Point / Gambit Points, (Gambit is map-specific and usually center of the map etc)
points of pieces remaining undefeated
Reserves and pieces not on the field generally do not count* (*Unless they were on a figure being transported etc, those technicalities)

Locally, according to GenCon D.C.I. standing Floor Rules (the successor to Wizards Arbiter Framework)
That order is concurrent.
Some locales have instituted like Chess, a "Time Per Move" to prevent delaying tactics for a round etc.
In an effort to keep tournaments punctual.
I feel time-per-move can be an intimidation tactic of itself sometimes. it also nerfs Activation Control themed squads to an extent.

If those are still tied,
and time permits a dynamic duos sudden death round,
or if players agree to a bye (1point each in Round Robin format, same as a draw).
In the event no compromise can be found in time, its usually later in the tournament,
so people will award based on previous 2 or 3 rounds.
If its a key event, like a Regional, National etc or International,
review and arbiters are more thorough than at local league or invitationals.
Chargers
Posted: Thursday, February 17, 2022 9:53:44 AM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
For a tournament or an individual game?


For a tournament.

Although we did have a game in the last tourney that was decided by one kill point, I don't think we've ever seen a tie.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Thursday, February 17, 2022 10:10:44 AM
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Chargers wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
For a tournament or an individual game?


For a tournament.

Although we did have a game in the last tourney that was decided by one kill point, I don't think we've ever seen a tie.


If a game ends in a tie, the tiebreaker is whoever has a piece closest to the center of the map. If that is also a tie, whichever piece is higher cost wins.


For tournaments, match points is the first criteria (with 3-2-1-0 scoring). If there are ties, I'm pretty sure we still use the floor rules as posted here:

https://swmgamers.com/PDF/Rules/Floor%20Rules.pdf

We haven't had a new floor rules document in years, but the only changes have been the Map List (which changes every year) and balance committee rulings (which don't affect the tiebreakers).

Tiebreakers:

1. Total wins
2. Head to head (Only applicable if a player beats all other tied players)
3. Strength of schedule 1 - player's strength of schedule, minus the player's worst win. (For SOS, add up the Match Points of the opponents, with the exception of the worst win.)
4. Strength of schedule 2 - same as SOS 1, but only counting the defeated players
5. Strength of schedule 3 - Full strength of schedule, including worst win
6. Roll off D20

It's not stated in the floor rules, but I'd say that in the case of a tie with 3 or more players, after one player wins a tiebreaker, you restart from the beginning with the remaining players.
kobayashimaru
Posted: Friday, February 18, 2022 12:27:47 AM
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I stand corrected;
FlyingArrows' restating of the Floor Rules is officially official.


Quote:
It's not stated in the floor rules, but I'd say that in the case of a tie with 3 or more players, after one player wins a tiebreaker, you restart from the beginning with the remaining players.

Brilliant idea, Flyin'Arrow.
If time permits vs venue and logistics.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Friday, February 18, 2022 8:25:26 AM
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kobayashimaru wrote:
I stand corrected;
FlyingArrows' restating of the Floor Rules is officially official.


Quote:
It's not stated in the floor rules, but I'd say that in the case of a tie with 3 or more players, after one player wins a tiebreaker, you restart from the beginning with the remaining players.

Brilliant idea, Flyin'Arrow.
If time permits vs venue and logistics.


LOL.

Not restart the tournament, though that's a novel idea. Laugh

I just meant to restart the tiebreaking process.
Darth_Jim
Posted: Friday, February 18, 2022 2:27:53 PM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
It's not stated in the floor rules, but I'd say that in the case of a tie with 3 or more players, after one player wins a tiebreaker, you restart from the beginning with the remaining players.


I would disagree. I think you should continue from that point, since there was resolution of that tiebreaker.
FlyingArrow
Posted: Friday, February 18, 2022 7:29:49 PM
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Darth_Jim wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
It's not stated in the floor rules, but I'd say that in the case of a tie with 3 or more players, after one player wins a tiebreaker, you restart from the beginning with the remaining players.


I would disagree. I think you should continue from that point, since there was resolution of that tiebreaker.


Suppose 3 players are tied, and steps 1 through 4 don't break the tie. On step 5 player A beats out players B and C, but B and C are still tied (identical records and SOS). B beat C head-to-head. That was ignored in a 3-player tie, since A hadn't played both of B and C. Now that A is no longer in the tie, I think you should return to the top... B wins the tie based on head-to-head win over C. The other alternative is to proceed to step 6 and roll a d20. That doesn't seem right.

I don't see it spelled out in the floor rules, though, so it's either an ambiguity or (just as likely) I overlooked it. Someone probably knows better than me.
Darth_Jim
Posted: Friday, February 18, 2022 8:16:30 PM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
I don't see it spelled out in the floor rules, though, so it's either an ambiguity or (just as likely) I overlooked it. Someone probably knows better than me.


And me. If the community deems it important enough, I'd like to see how others feel.
DarkDracul
Posted: Saturday, February 19, 2022 8:45:08 AM
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In almost twenty years of playing and nearly 100 tournaments and I have never seen tie breakers go to Step 6.

I think it should be decided by a best of 3 thumb wrestling match.
Darth_Jim
Posted: Saturday, February 19, 2022 9:39:12 AM
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DarkDracul wrote:
In almost twenty years of playing and nearly 100 tournaments and I have never seen tie breakers go to Step 6.

I think it should be decided by a best of 3 thumb wrestling match.


Totally unfair. I only have 2 thumbs.

I give this idea a thumbs down.
DarkDracul
Posted: Saturday, February 19, 2022 12:04:48 PM
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Darth_Jim wrote:
DarkDracul wrote:
In almost twenty years of playing and nearly 100 tournaments and I have never seen tie breakers go to Step 6.

I think it should be decided by a best of 3 thumb wrestling match.


Totally unfair. I only have 2 thumbs.

I give this idea a thumbs down.

Yeah, if it comes down to a battle of "third thumbs" I'm out too. Laugh
Chargers
Posted: Monday, February 21, 2022 3:19:34 PM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
Suppose 3 players are tied, and steps 1 through 4 don't break the tie. On step 5 player A beats out players B and C, but B and C are still tied (identical records and SOS). B beat C head-to-head. That was ignored in a 3-player tie, since A hadn't played both of B and C. Now that A is no longer in the tie, I think you should return to the top... B wins the tie based on head-to-head win over C. The other alternative is to proceed to step 6 and roll a d20. That doesn't seem right.


This is why I ask. We had something similar (not exactly, but close) is our latest six-player gathering. The early steps didn't seem to resolve it, and I'd forgotten about the die roll. But, yeah, I don't think anyone wants a die roll determining things.

Your logic of going back through the steps seems to make sense, though.
Chargers
Posted: Friday, April 8, 2022 6:30:00 AM
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FlyingArrow wrote:
I don't see it spelled out in the floor rules, though, so it's either an ambiguity or (just as likely) I overlooked it. Someone probably knows better than me.


Sorry to be a pest. We had some input, but didn't see a resolution.

Last I knew, the three player tie was an all-or-nothing tie-breaker. The idea of A "winning" part of the tie-breaker then sending B and C back to the top to go back through the steps makes sense.

But as FlyingArrow noted, that should be spelled out if that is the desire and/or intent.
N3rdSl4y3r
Posted: Friday, April 8, 2022 1:13:20 PM
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It comes down to whoever has the best named team.
urbanjedi
Posted: Friday, April 8, 2022 1:36:10 PM
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Chargers wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
I don't see it spelled out in the floor rules, though, so it's either an ambiguity or (just as likely) I overlooked it. Someone probably knows better than me.


Sorry to be a pest. We had some input, but didn't see a resolution.

Last I knew, the three player tie was an all-or-nothing tie-breaker. The idea of A "winning" part of the tie-breaker then sending B and C back to the top to go back through the steps makes sense.

But as FlyingArrow noted, that should be spelled out if that is the desire and/or intent.


I am not sure how rich has it set up in the program, but I believe that once you have removed one player from the Tiebreakers, you start the process over with the remaining players.
Chargers
Posted: Sunday, April 10, 2022 6:10:34 AM
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urbanjedi wrote:
[quote=Chargers]I am not sure how rich has it set up in the program, but I believe that once you have removed one player from the Tiebreakers, you start the process over with the remaining players.


Which program? The Apple app? When will there be an Android version?
FlyingArrow
Posted: Sunday, April 10, 2022 10:53:50 AM
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Chargers wrote:
urbanjedi wrote:
[quote=Chargers]I am not sure how rich has it set up in the program, but I believe that once you have removed one player from the Tiebreakers, you start the process over with the remaining players.


Which program? The Apple app? When will there be an Android version?


There was an Android version at one point. I don't have it installed right now and can't locate it, though.
TimmerB123
Posted: Thursday, April 21, 2022 8:00:10 AM
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As far as I know, it has always been as Flying_Arrow described. When 3 or more players are tied, go down the list in order of tiebreakers until the tie is broken, then start back at tiebreaker #1 with the remaining still tied players.
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