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Yes, ABM needs to be scaled back.
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4
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26.666666
%
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Perhaps review ABM but no major errata needed.
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3
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20.000000
%
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No, ABM has become integral to the game.
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8
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53.333333
%
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 4/18/2008
Posts: 1,168
Location: Kokomo
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How does the community really feel about Advanced Battle Meditation as it impacts the competitive game?
Is this something that a majority of players would like to see changed, and should the BC bother discussing it?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 7/27/2008
Posts: 1,420
Location: Los Angeles, California
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At 200pts, she is ok. ABM is ok. OR doesn't need to be neutered, as the community is so focused on the Commander effect destroying aspect of the Force power, that we must not forget the +10 damage, that is extremely important to boost to this faction, in an already behind the eight ball faction. If the BC erratas ABM to turn off at the end of the round, instead of at the end of Bastila's next turn, I wouldn't play her anymore in 200pt competition.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 4/29/2008
Posts: 1,955
Location: Canada
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I can see it both ways. Yes, she's been part of the game for what now...15 years? ABM has absolutely shaped how the OR faction has developed, and things have 'balanced' around it.
However, it just freakin' sucks that some squad types simply cannot compete due to the presence of ABM. The damage boost is fine (every squad has one nowadays). But Disruptive that lasts two rounds, and is also boardwide, and can also only be turned off by somehow getting one of your attackers way deep into the opponent's starting zone...that's ugly.
So in the end I voted that yes, it needs to be scaled back. What squads could be played on a competitive level if ABM was no longer a factor?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 7/27/2008
Posts: 1,420
Location: Los Angeles, California
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I feel that everyone wants to give too much help to other factions. In 24 annual competitions ( Gen Con's & Vassal Con's combined ), OR has only championed 1 of the 24 ( 2011- 200pt Champ- OR - "Bastila's Battlemasters" (Jester007) ). This was 14 years ago!  Taking the best piece off the chess board for OR, by watering her down, is a step down, and a severe blow to the OR. This will only hurt OR's chances in ever winning another GenCon or Vassal Con. Please keep her the same  PS How many of the following squads, that rely on Commander effects won, even with Bastila in the mix, as she is right now?!?!?!?!
6. 2011- 200pt Champ- OR - "Bastila's Battlemasters" (Jester007) 7. 2012- 200pt Champ- Republic - "This Party's Over" (thereisnotry) 8. 2013- 200pt Champ- NR - "Prof. Luke's Art Class" (sephiroth99is) 9. 2014- 200pt Champ- Mandos - "Movin Mandos" (Weeks) 10. 2015- 200pt Champ- Imps - "Wuher the Hypocrite" (Darth_Jim) 11. 2016- 200pt Champ- Rebels - "Prison Break" (thereisnotry) 12. 2017- 200pt Champ- Imps - "Roger Stone of SWM V2" (atmsalad) now known as (Darth_Frenchy) 13. 2018- 200pt Champ- Imps - "Les Femmes Fatales Redux: O.C.D. (Opportunistic Charging Domination)" (TimmerB123) 14. 2019- 200pt Champ- Imps - "Swappy McCool" - ( Lily_wan ) 15. 2020- 200pt Champ- Mandos "Jangalorn" - (thereisnotry) 16. 2021- 200pt (VassalCon) Champ- Separatists - "Jabba Momma" (DarkDracul) 17. 2022- 200pt Champ- Sith - "Sith Triumvirate" (Randy) 18. 2022- 200pt (VassalCon) Champ - Fringe - "Jabba's Return v2" (gandalfthegreatestwizard) 19. 2023 - 200pt Champ - Mandos - "Io Triumphe!" (Urbanjedi) 20. 2023 - 200pt (VassalCon) Champ - Sith - "Sith Triumvirate" (Randy) 21. 2024 - 200pt GenCon Champ - Sith - "Presence of the Hord" (thereisnotry) 22. 2024 - 200pt VassalCon Champ - Mandos - "Io Triumphe!" (Urbanjedi) 23. 2025 - 200pt GenCon Champ - Seps - "Bounty Assault" (Hi-Fives) 24. 2025 - 200pt VassalCon Champ - Sith - "Star Forge, Nothing but Star Forge" (Randy) There is no need to change her, imho...........................................................
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
Groups: Member
Joined: 4/29/2008
Posts: 1,955
Location: Canada
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The easy answer to that question is this: Most of the time she hasn't had much to work with. Now she does: both Thon/Nomi and also Revan PK are top tier squad archetypes.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 7/27/2008
Posts: 1,420
Location: Los Angeles, California
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thereisnotry wrote:The easy answer to that question is this: Most of the time she hasn't had much to work with. Now she does: both Thon/Nomi and also Revan PK are top tier squad archetypes. At the last GenCon the following happened; -Results for Round 3-
Jordan (Hi-Fives) defeated Micah (Overley28) (3-1) on Theed Palace, 200-109
Jordan (Hi-Fives) (Separatist) --Bounty Assault-- 43 Cad Bane, Bounty Hunter 35 Asajj Ventress, Nightsister 33 Aurra Sing, Assassin 28 Mira of Nar Shaddaa 26 Moralo Eval 12 Rodian Assassin 8 R7 Astromech Droid 9 Mouse Droid x3 6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2 (200pts. 12 activations) Theed Palace Micah (Overley28) (OR) --Sun-riding to Paradise-- 52 Master Thon 48 Nomi Sunrider, Legacy of the Light Side 33 Bastila Shan, Jedi Master 27 General Vaklu, Defender of Onderon 14 Old Republic Senator 11 Teethree (T3-M4) 6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2 9 XT-6 Droid x3 (200pts. 11 activations) Theed Palace With Bastila as she is currently, with Nomi/Thon, Seps beat her soundly, 200-109! In fact, your Maul Seps team that really depends on CE's, edged out a victory vs Bastila/Nomi/Thon; Trevor (thereisnotry) defeated Micah (Overley28) (3-1) on Theed Palace, 200-185Both Nomi/Thon/Bastila losses were against Seps, I might add! Further in fact, the 2 OR Bastila teams at GenCon went 4-4, placing 5th and 8th place, out of 11 competitors! That is hardly a placing that would give any indicator/criteria that Bastila needs to be changed, imho -Leaderboard after 4 rounds- 1st: 10 pts: Drew (N3rdSl4y3r) (4-0) WWWW 2nd: 9 pts: Jordan (Hi-Fives) (3-1) WWWL 3rd: 9 pts: Trevor (thereisnotry) (3-1) LWWW 4th: 8 pts: Mike (AceAce) (2-2) LWLW 5th: 8 pts: Micah (Overley28) (2-2) WWLL6th: 7 pts: Jason (urbanjedi) (2-2) WLLW 7th: 7 pts: Randy (Randy! Randy!) (2-2) WLWL 8th: 6 pts: Logan (Son of a Bith) (2-2) WLLW9th: 6 pts: Franklyn (Grimlyn) (2-2) LWWL 10th: 4 pts: Bryan (DarkDracul) (1-3) LLLW 11th: 3 pts: Laura (UrbanShmi) (1-3) LLWL 12th: 0 pts: Bye (0-4) LLLL
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 4/29/2008
Posts: 1,955
Location: Canada
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I never said that she's dominating the competition. My contention is that ABM artificially restricts the meta.
In the GenCon example that you gave, I was one of the people who defeated Micah's Thon/Nomi/Bastila squad. If we played that match 4 more times, I'm fairly confident that I'd lose all 4 of those. The only reason I won was because Thon's dice completely failed him when attacking Maul. That, and I was able to kill T3 and lock the door separating Thon/Nomi from the rest of my squad. These things would not happen if we were to play again; I got lucky. He almost surely should've beaten me, but the dice saved by tail in that game.
I'm not going to continue back and forth debating this issue. People have been complaining about ABM for a long time, and all of these points have been made multiple times. We'll see if the BC does anything about it.
You're welcome to have the last word, if you'd like...but I sincerely doubt there's anything new to say.
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 4/30/2008
Posts: 2,147
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I agree that this is pretty much a dead horse, but I did have one thought.
What if you had to choose between shutting off the CEs OR getting the plus 10 damage (but not both)
Or if it required LOS?
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 10/17/2010
Posts: 3,687
Location: Beggers Canyon Tatooine
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ABM has been around since 2010
Players have had 15 years to adapt
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 10/17/2010
Posts: 3,687
Location: Beggers Canyon Tatooine
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Maybe look at how ABM has fared, not just tourney wins, but how high they placed
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Rank: Advanced Bloo Milk Member
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Joined: 4/20/2015
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jak wrote:Maybe look at how ABM has fared, not just tourney wins, but how high they placed jak...jak, Now that's a name I've not heard in a long time...a long time.
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