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I am sorry but he should not be able to give out Twin since he doesn't have it. All the other pieces that give out SA have it. I know in the past even Designers had to change their Ideas because the character didnt give it out.
There needs to be rules. Pieces shouldn't be able to just give out anything they want.
Jon
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Not true.
CS Durge gives out momentum and doesn't have it.
GAW Rodian Trader gives out heal and grenades and doesn't have either one.
And those are just two WOTC pieces off the top of my head. I am sure I could find others.
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His damage would be fairly ridiculous with double/twin/dark temptation; he'd be attacking unique Sith at +25 for 50s four times.
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There actually is one good reason that all characters giving out abilities should have that ability. What do you think that is, Jonny? What is your specific reasoning as to why this is bad? Because the only reason you've given is "because that's the way it should be", which holds absolutely no weight.
(There are plenty of potential reasons why a character shouldn't have what they give out, so it's reasonable when it happens. Just making clear that I actually think it's fine that Cade doesn't have Twin, because the reasons for him not to have it are better than the reason for him to have it)
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Saves space on the card...
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FlyingArrow wrote:Saves space on the card... It doesn't actually save space, but it does make it much more readable. But yeah, that's the only good reason, and it isn't such a big deal to be cast in stone.
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This is a real big deal all other pieces that had Camaraderie also have the SA they give out. This has nothing to do with cade it has to do with rules that you guys as designers made for yourself and you are breaking them.
I also know that pieces were changed in the past because they gave out a SA via Camaraderie but didnt have it.
So now any piece can give out any SA they want?
So why do all the other pieces that have Camaraderie have the SA they give out. Again this has nothing to do with the piece.
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Echo24 wrote:FlyingArrow wrote:Saves space on the card... It doesn't actually save space, but it does make it much more readable. But yeah, that's the only good reason, and it isn't such a big deal to be cast in stone. It saves space if you're comparing giving out an ability he has (that doesn't have to be defined) versus an ability he doesn't have (that would have to be defined). But you're right - it doesn't save space to add another ability to him.
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while in the past I would have agreed with you.... I do not here. It is clear the designers are trying to do what people have asked, and make some old pieces better without replacing them. Using Cade to make Jariah and Deliah were both in need of help drastically and twin just makes them immediately better. Maybe he doesn't have twin for gameplay/balance issues, i like double on him more myself so i can dark temptation and shoot more stuff and spread the damage as opposed to being stuck with twin.
^*Edit^*
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Deaths_Baine wrote:If anything i would think people should be complaining about a 14 point new republic piece that can shut down force powers in 6 square area. This game did not need even more force/jedi hate. It shuts down Force Abilities right? So Bastila, Atris etc - not anywhere near as extreme. Jonnyb815 wrote:This is a real big deal
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Jonnyb815 wrote:This is a real big deal all other pieces that had Camaraderie also have the SA they give out. This has nothing to do with cade it has to do with rules that you guys as designers made for yourself and you are breaking them.
I also know that pieces were changed in the past because they gave out a SA via but didnt have it.
So now any piece can give out any SA they want? If it's balanced, why not? What SPECIFICALLY is your reasoning against it?
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Eh, it's not that big of a deal to me. I more upset about getting railed by palps reborn in the future... Lol
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TheHutts wrote:Deaths_Baine wrote:If anything i would think people should be complaining about a 14 point new republic piece that can shut down force powers in 6 square area. This game did not need even more force/jedi hate. It shuts down Force Abilities right? So Bastila, Atris etc - not anywhere near as extreme. oh man i thought it meant any force power.... read it WAAAYYYY WRONG thanks for pointing that out  ^quickly goes and edits post^ sorry guys... carry on lol.
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TheHutts wrote:Deaths_Baine wrote:If anything i would think people should be complaining about a 14 point new republic piece that can shut down force powers in 6 square area. This game did not need even more force/jedi hate. It shuts down Force Abilities right? So Bastila, Atris etc - not anywhere near as extreme. Correct. Force Abilities, not Force Powers.
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Echo24 wrote:Jonnyb815 wrote:This is a real big deal all other pieces that had Camaraderie also have the SA they give out. This has nothing to do with cade it has to do with rules that you guys as designers made for yourself and you are breaking them.
I also know that pieces were changed in the past because they gave out a SA via but didnt have it.
So now any piece can give out any SA they want? If it's balanced, why not? What SPECIFICALLY is your reasoning against it? Because there were rules set when the SA was made. I will PM more.
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Kyndra Draay gives out an ability she doesn't have, this is not the first time this has happend. I'm not sure I see the big deal.
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Camaraderie is a v-set designed SA (I think?). No reason why the designers can't use it in whatever way they want. Jonnyb815 wrote:This is a real big deal
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I for one am grateful to the designers for this. in the past they have been so stuck on what Wizards did and what other designers did things had to be changed to fit. Glad to see someone take the this is our game approach and if they need this ability to be better and it makes sense for that person to be the one to give it to them great.
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I don't really think him handing out Twin as that big of a deal. I mean I suppose you could swap out Double Attack for twin, but then that would mess up Wolf's Camaraderie. (backlash) Twin makes the targets better (not necessarily good enough to be used)
What would you suggest he hand out instead of Twin Johnny?
As for Kol, I personally really like him, ( I just wish we got an OR Force Spirit lol) as I see it Force Control would be mainly used against Bastila. (which I think many people would be happy about)
Anything else it would mess up?
Anyways I totaly agree, we shouldn't be punishing force users, but consider this: This guy is a FORCE Spirit, who needs to be attached to a FORCE using character. This is simply a case of Force user vs force user, not nerfing all force users like say Ylsimiri. (or however you spell it lol) In that frame of thought you should be railing against any new characters with Force Absorb or Force Defense, cus they hurt force users far more. Besides the New Republic is a force user dominated faction, so I doubt they would roll over and become a force hating faction
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Deathwielded wrote:I don't really think him handing out Twin as that big of a deal. I mean I suppose you could swap out Double Attack for twin, but then that would mess up Wolf's Camaraderie. (backlash) Twin makes the targets better (not necessarily good enough to be used)
What would you suggest he hand out instead of Twin Johnny?
As for Kol, I personally really like him, ( I just wish we got an OR Force Spirit lol) as I see it Force Control would be mainly used against Bastila. (which I think many people would be happy about)
Anything else it would mess up?
Anyways I totaly agree, we shouldn't be punishing force users, but consider this: This guy is a FORCE Spirit, who needs to be attached to a FORCE using character. This is simply a case of Force user vs force user, not nerfing all force users like say Ylsimiri. (or however you spell it lol) In that frame of thought you should be railing against any new characters with Force Absorb or Force Defense, cus they hurt force users far more. Besides the New Republic is a force user dominated faction, so I doubt they would roll over and become a force hating faction I read it wrong when I first read it, I thought it was all force powers, I edited my post
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