Yes. (Until it leaves the squad.)

i talked this over with urbanjedi a year or so ago after the Killik Queen came out about how to get the Camaderie to trigger on your own pieces that become Killiks in the course of the game. You need to have something trigger it for them where it causes any at the start of the skirmish effects to occur. There aren't a lot of these, but if you have, for example, abilities like Reserves, Porg's Nest, dismount, Vehicle, or Force Dominate, these kinds of abilities will trigger this check for all Killiks in the squad to gain that Cunning Attack and Exclusive Loyalty bonus, thereby giving them those abilities from that point onward. Do for example, if you have Maul and Dengar on Swoop Bike in a squad with the Killik Queen and Maul fails the Join save and gets the Killik SA, he won't get Cunning attack and Exclusive Loyalty right away. If you use Dengar on Swoop however after Maul has gotten Killik, and Dengar uses the Vehicle SA to swap into a different version of Dengar, the at the start of the skirmish condition will trigger since you are bringing in a new character and things could change in the game. From that point on, now Maul becomes a true Killik with all his Killik bonuses from the Queen.

TINT, I think you are confused- and I don't blame you because Join is a complicated ability, and works in a confusing way due to an oversight in its creation.

I was answering the question about what happens with Camaraderie in the situation where an enemy Killik joins your squad due to a failed Join save (6) after being damaged by the Queen. Not a question about the other Join save, where an ally fails the save (16) and becomes a Killik. My answer (and Bryan's) was not contrary to Mando's answer. We were answering different questions.

If an enemy fails a Join save (16) and becomes a Killik, it does not gain the effects of Camaraderie. (It is not an ally at this point.)

If a Killik enemy is damaged by a Killik Queen and fails a Join save (6), it gains the effects of Camaraderie (for as long as it is in your squad).

If an ally fails a Join save (16) and becomes a Killik, it does not gain the effects of Camaraderie. This is because Camaraderie is only applied once after setup and again after a character leaves or is added to your squad. If that does occur later on then they would gain the effects.



This is the way Camaraderie has consistently been defined going back a long way. I'm told that there are good reasons- related to broken combos and/or rules consistency- for it to work this specific way (I wasn't around back when that was discussed, but no doubt it's true). It is also the way that commander effects which last "for the rest of the skirmish" work, as the rules committee decided more recently. (I know that was for similarly good reasons, because I was part of those discussions.)

I don't believe that any of the designers on set 25 (I was one) intended for Join and Camaraderie to interact the way they do. I think we all assumed at the time that if an ally became a Killik, then it would immediately get Cunning and Exclusive Loyalty, but we were wrong. The way it works as I described above is confusing, not what designers intended, and overall a bad mechanic (though I don't think that is any designer's fault, more of an unfortunate coincidence). It's not something anyone would intuit based on reading the card text.

After the issue was raised, TJ and I privately discussed if we could "save the designers from themselves" by retconning Camaraderie to work some other way. We didn't pursue that avenue. I think we were right not to do that, since there would be knock-on effects on other interactions. However, I think retconning Join to say "you re-check Camaraderie whenever a character gains Killik", thus making it work the intuitive way, would be a much more elegant solution. And this I will discuss with the rules committee.

Thank you, Joe. This is helpful.

I agree! I think this would make a lot more sense and would probably make the Killik Queen into a playable piece.

The rules committee has agreed to alter the way Join works, so the loophole is closed and it works as intended.

http://www.bloomilk.com/SpecialAbility/2010