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Zam Wesell, Bounter Hunter (my version) Options
Darth Grievous
Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 11:57:49 AM
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Wow thanks, I think it needs to be play tested a bit. I think declaring it per round would be good, but none of what would be declared are that nasty. Swarm not very scary, self destruct could be very bad and also quite fun. Gungans dont have anything, neither do trandoshans, so it does limit it a bit. Now if she shapeshifted into a droid LOL, that would be terrible. Thanks again everyone
imyurhukaberry
Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 1:04:12 PM
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I would think that she/he would be limited to living species. (aka no droids, anything with mounted weapon, etc)
HanSolo79
Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 4:14:36 PM
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Wookiees have some decent CE's and if she "declared" Wookie she could also benefit from Clone Commander Gree's CE which includes Wookiees in it :D
Darth Grievous
Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 10:14:24 PM
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Unfortunately Zam would not benefit from Gree's CE, because it states Non-Unique Wookiees, she is still Unique. But Merumeru's would work
Wysten
Posted: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 10:48:23 PM
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Quote:
not that i disagree that she isnt a brawler, but one thing you have to think about is who took her out. Jango Fett is the one who finally killed her and he is an expert in his field.


It does not matter much in this case. She had already been defeated by Obi-Wan very quickly. She was in shock from losing a limb and unaware of his pressence. Basically, Boba was in his element and she was at a enormous disadvantage in terms of condiction and awareness. All he did was made sure that she did not say anything.

I still think that she should not go too high on the hp chart and be in preportion with experienced, non-force senstives, as she's not shown any prefesency for ground combat in the games or movie. Once Obi found where she was, it took seconds to take her down, from igniting the lightsaber to lobbing her arm off. Hehehe

Infact, she could possibly have cloaked really, because of her shapeshifting properties would make it very hard to get a bender on her. Which is a possiblity for two figures, one that plays off her racial attribute with stealth to keep her cheap, and a more expensive version with Cloaked.
Darth Percocet
Posted: Thursday, April 29, 2010 2:03:26 PM
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I would say put her back to the original 41 pt cost & 100hp... I mean the old one was 45 pts with 90 & how they re-do in this game thats what they would do. I dont see it being such a big deal. You need to remember in this game that it is a game & not to look too much at logic much.

I like the Shape Shifter ability as is, IMO there is no CE's that effect a certain species that would make her broken. She should be able to gain from all types of species CE's all the time in a game. Your gonna be waisting 41 pts on her & by the time you build elsewhere what you need I.E.: door control, tempo control, swap, booming voice, whorm's twin.. etc. Your gonna be down to very little pts to fit any species effecting Commanders.

At 100hp she isnt gonna be unkillable. She is fine at 100hp & with the SS ability exactly as is effecting her at all time no matter how many CE's she gets at once.. That ability is i think one of the best abilities created by someone making a custom but i dont see people putting all CE's that effect a certain species just to boost her at 100hp because she wont be killing everyone & everything if you allow her to be effected by all CE's at one time & she will still be killable, there isnt any combo of CE's that would make her unbeatable & i dont think she would be used in a competitve run, because there is alot better surport out there for less or a little more of her cost, so i think she was fine the very first way she was.. IMO... great custom
Darth Percocet
Posted: Thursday, April 29, 2010 2:18:50 PM
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Ok now lets look at the stats...

41 pt cost i think is perfect, maybe should be at say 42/43 but still fine at 41. You got Dash RS at 28 & look what he can do as a shooter. He is so easy to boost it isnt funny. Also these stats dont make her a bangin shooter, its mainly focused on the Shape Shifter Ability.

Now she has a 19 defense, so she will get hit, unless you build her with some booster stats like def & att in which your spending more pts just to boost her & this would take away from bringing in specific commanders with species CE's.

Att at a 12, again she isnt gonna be killing everything in a game automatic, there are alot better shooters for a lil more or less than her.

She has double attack & giving GMA is easily done but at pt cost & again she isnt that great of a shooter just to try boosting her. Bounty hunter & kohuun as the old one has so thats perfect, now i would say you could give her any 1 of the two accurate or sniper because both would suit her.

Now stealth, Stealth these days isnt as big as it once was, sure you can build a SS team but nowdays almost every faction has a key piece you would build in your squad regardless of building a hate squad to SS that has force sense. So stealth IMO isnt as big as it once was, plus she was an assassin so it suits her.

& now the Shape Shifter SA, i would let it limit as many as she can at one time, basically any Att boost that is flat out cant stack, same with def. such as Hett's. & self destruct 10 isnt gonna be a key depender on winning a game so getting an Ugg on top isnt bad. Then what MeruMeru gives, she would get Close Combat fighting, but then by being adjacent she becomes vulnerable with out her stealth & her low def.

I mean all around as is, people would use her yea just because of that SA but also there gonna use other stuff that is competitve which will take away from the pt cost that would give her SA's & CE's that effect certain species & as i said she isnt the best shooter out there just to boost her up with these certain Commanders. So i liked her the way she was originally.
Darth Grievous
Posted: Thursday, April 29, 2010 9:42:35 PM
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Wow nice to see someone write so much about this one custom, Thanks Darth Percocet. I was watching Episode II when that shapeshifter ability came to me. So lets talk about what she can shapeshift into at this point. I included a list on the original but now some people think I should add Tusken to the list. I only added ones that currently exist as SAs now ie; wookie, trandoshans, etc. Are there others that should be added? or keep it the way it is now. Personaly as much fun as it would be to add Tusken then there would be so many others I would have to add, Rodian, Utapaun, etc. So I personally think it should stay the way it is. Thoughts?
Darth Percocet
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 2:39:42 AM
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Darth Grievous wrote:
Wow nice to see someone write so much about this one custom, Thanks Darth Percocet. I was watching Episode II when that shapeshifter ability came to me. So lets talk about what she can shapeshift into at this point. I included a list on the original but now some people think I should add Tusken to the list. I only added ones that currently exist as SAs now ie; wookie, trandoshans, etc. Are there others that should be added? or keep it the way it is now. Personaly as much fun as it would be to add Tusken then there would be so many others I would have to add, Rodian, Utapaun, etc. So I personally think it should stay the way it is. Thoughts?


I mean IMO i think she should be able to shape into any species, i dont see any specific species combo's that will make her broken, most are just adding to a stat bonus w/ the accasional special ability addition but i mean i might be wrong but i dont see not on combo that will make her broken. Tuskens & Wookies is mainly what i got my eye on, with Hett & MeruMeru, she can gain evade & the +4 ATT from Hett which will be open to her gaining GMA but i still dont see her being unstopable with GMA & the +4 att. Then w/ MeruMeru she will get close combat, etc. Which as i stated before that would mean she gets the +4 against adjacent enemies which would stack w/ Hett's CE but this is what im seeing. #1 when she would get this along w/ demolish, she is losing stealth against this adjacent enemy, & her 19 defense gets her in trouble so thats where in my eye it gets balanced.

Now i dunno if she is able to transform into vongs because i just know of her what i read in maybe 2 books & the movie. But if she could do the vong thing too i think that is amazing, because now vong can actually get a half decent shooter in there midst. & if she could then that might be the only time you would actually put her into a squad as a good shooter but still theres alot of better shooters you could go with in fringe but still she would be able to get boosted from there specific CE's, so yea again i dont know too much on Zam from what i read or watched via movie, but even so i just cant see her broken like that & i might be missing a CE combo that might be broken but at this time i dont see it..
countrydude82487
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 3:30:02 AM
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i would let her change into any species. i DOnt see her counting as a tusken being too broken, wookies either. I would have to agree with the vong think but the idea with her being able to trun into voong doesnt matter too much, because the abillities affect characters in the Vong faction.
Darth Grievous
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 6:33:50 AM
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I completely forgot about Vong, how can I specify this in the SA? If i just say any species, some would confuse things that like creatures.

If we include Vong, she coudl gain Momentum, Poison, Spit Poison, Cunning Attack, Shaper,Scarification and a bonus from the Vong Collaborator.
Darth Percocet
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 7:06:14 AM
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Darth Grievous wrote:
I completely forgot about Vong, how can I specify this in the SA? If i just say any species, some would confuse things that like creatures.

If we include Vong, she coudl gain Momentum, Poison, Spit Poison, Cunning Attack, Shaper,Scarification and a bonus from the Vong Collaborator.


True... but on the brightside if she goes into Vong she would then become limted to the vong CE's without figs like merumeru & hett. So question is are any of the vong CE's combined gonna make her broken. So if she gains momentum she would get +4 att & +10 dam,then could add cunning to it to get her a total of +8 att & +20 dam bonnus w/ double att. Well on the Vong side there isnt many shooters & u gotta see pt cost to get her there CE's will add up becuz if it does then atleast its gonna limit to what u can fit for her to get.this might make Vong more playable in a competitive run. But still she'll have her +19 def so she isnt unkillable.

I mean when u look at boba BH, w/ BH he is at a +18 att & then u can get him easily opp,extra att, etc. to where he gets a chance to kill everything with Dis. Now with Zam maybe if u upped her cost a bit then she wont become so vicious on Vong cuz then it will cost pts to boost her in it which then u make the decision of just boosting her or not. So i mean you could easily just make the SS SA to be for any specific species if Vong would make her broken, so i would just do some studing with what u could make with it being no limit on the SA in terms of species to see what u wanna do with it.

Im actually gonna dab around into all of the stuff she can get if its for all species & if u want ill help ya with the stats, i dont want any credit cuz u came up with her, ill just help becausee i love the SS SA & i think its one of the cooler ones made.. so ill pm u with my findings..
Darth Grievous
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 10:36:33 AM
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Sounds good Darth Percocet, I am still unsure of Vong, if we up her cost more I am worried no one would want to play her anyway. Im worried about her get Ooglish Masquer and then self destruct plus cunning, sniper, double, shaper, scarification when hurt. This will give her 16Att, 40dmg twice. Well maybe its for the best when I can do all sorts of stuff with my HK-50 Opp 40 twice for a cheap piece.
countrydude82487
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 2:24:05 PM
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Darth Grievous wrote:
Sounds good Darth Percocet, I am still unsure of Vong, if we up her cost more I am worried no one would want to play her anyway. Im worried about her get Ooglish Masquer and then self destruct plus cunning, sniper, double, shaper, scarification when hurt. This will give her 16Att, 40dmg twice. Well maybe its for the best when I can do all sorts of stuff with my HK-50 Opp 40 twice for a cheap piece.


I agree that that would be powerful, but on a side not ooglith masquer is only a non unique ally
markedman247
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 2:40:49 PM
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Shapeshifter is a good idea and I think it should be at the start of the game ability like Light Tutor and such.

I know that "Yuuzhan Vong Warrior" is a descriptor so that you can use the Yuuzhan Vong Subaltern. However, it is just a special ability. I would just leave it as "Trandoshan," "Ewok," "Ugnaught," "Wookiee" and "Tusken" (Or any others as a Vset may allow).

My only concern is that there really isn't any difference between picking "Tusken" and "Trooper" since they are both just discriptors. Zam can't become a Corellian Pirate but if "Pirate" was a SA, then she could potentially be partnered with Hando Ohka.

I am sure that's been discussed.
Weeks
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 4:26:28 PM
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But dont you see that giving Vong a shooter is a good thing? sure if you cost her at 41 she costs a hefty amount but that faction needs a shooter. Right now they can only compete if they use Cad Bane and all he gets is the Super Stealth. Zam in Vong would make that faction really Shine. She can grab Cunning Attack and SS pretty easy and you still got room for bombs/hunters. She wont be force Immune, all she would get is the CE's and SA's which could make her into a force to be reconned with in the Vong Faction.

I personally love this concept and i def think you should make it to include Tuskan's and Vong. Building around zam would still be tough but def worth it. Hett and Flobi and a TBSV would be another good build for her. Its not Broken at all if you have to pay such a hefty price for her i mean 41 points isnt just a throw in for squads. Keep her with Kouhun, Double, stealth and Sniper is what i say.

With Sniper you wont have as much Worry about her putting 80 on something with Accurite Shot in the Vong Faction but still give her some versatility in picking her targets.

Bottom line. Vong would rock with this Zam, and their are far more broken combo's on ig-86 droids and GGDAC and you can get several of them into a squad you only get 1 zam and pay 41 for it.
Weeks
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 4:37:31 PM
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here's what you would do for the metagame if you let her use Vong ce's and SA's

--Zam--
41 PROXY
34 Nom Anor
21 Yuuzhan Vong Shaper
60 Yuuzhan Vong Jedi Hunter x3
11 Advance Agent, Officer
18 Advance Scout x3
6 Mouse Droid x2
9 Ugnaught Demolitionist x3

(200pts. 15 activations)

Proxy is Zam.

Boom Vong have a meta Squad with a Versital power shooter that has SS synergy on everything and everyone and cunning on everything to combat Act Control. Its tough and very competitive this is just one example of what you can build.
Jonnyb815
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 5:39:59 PM
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I think it should be all species that have a written SA,CE about them even Mandos are a species. She could be pretty sweet with the mandos.
Darth Grievous
Posted: Friday, April 30, 2010 11:54:57 PM
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I dont think Pirates or Mandos should be included because this was what I was worried about, everyone assumes everything is a species. Tuskens and Vong are a good add and at 41 points you have to spend a lot as is to get such a good ability. I will add Tusken and Vong to the list but no others at this point are worth adding. Thank you Weeks for testing her overall. I am headed to my comic shop today for Free Comic Book day and will be showing these stats around and then an official card will be printed and they are laminated and look just as good as WOTCs :)
Darth Grievous
Posted: Saturday, May 1, 2010 12:04:07 AM
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page 1 stats updated. Stats all the same, added Tusken and Vong.

Need a vote as far as Sniper or Accurate Shot?
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