ok, just thought while we were on the topic of low cost, easy to be buffed and exploit pieces I would bring this up. So it would seem the HP and that they don't have force immune is what makes them not a rule changing kind of thing.

just wanted to participate

I think you're correct that they are one of the worst remaining offenders. I don't think they're quite bad enough to warrant changing, but they might become a problem as other things are smoothed out.

One of the things I don't like is that the best swarms (Daala, Vong) are force immune, so Bastila doesn't shut them down. I think Bastila was good for the game, and it would be good if she continued to be a risk for fielding CE dependent squads. Not saying Vong shouldn't be force immune obviously, just shouldn't have got such a powerful swarm.

seems like the unpreventable damage should be the 1st thing to go.

At least if you can negate some dmg via armor, DR or the like then they would lose a significant amount of potential.

Another option would be adding some sort of draw back, like the user taking unpreventable damage as well, or automatically failing saves until their next turn.

Just bringing it up again.

Non Unique Vong are an issue. Blast Bugs were a bad idea, and exacerbate quite a lot, but I think now the main issues to focus on are actually the Lah Warriors and the Yun Ne-Shel Priest.

The Lah Warriors are simply undercosted. They really should be 14-16 pts each. Speed 8 is such a huge advantage, the fact that they cost less then the already outstanding High-Bred Warriors is nuts.

As for the Yun Ne-Shel Priest - the +4 to saves is certainly annoying, but not the most offensive part. Giving out Avoid Defeat is a major issue, and it is compounded by the +4 to saves. This is all un-disruptable, and is frequently used to make a bodyguard that can live forever. By design the priest was meant to strengthen Unique Vong. It failed miserably in that aspect, but original intent could be salvaged. If the Yun Ne-Shel Priest's main ability, Yun Ne'Shel Devotion (+4 to saves) only applied to Uniques - that would be a huge step in the correct direction. It also is odd mechanics that the ability itself applies to a whole squad. The ability should just be for that piece, and the CE should give the devotion. Giving out Avoid Defeat really should be dropped altogether. Here's what that would look like:

Yun-Ne'Shel Priest 13
Hit Points: 30
Defense: 16
Attack: 1
Damage: 10

Special Abilities
Melee Attack (Can attack only adjacent enemies)
Avoid Defeat (Whenever this character would be defeated, make 2 saves, each needing 11; if both succeed, this character has 10 Hit Points instead of being defeated)
Force Immunity (Enemies cannot affect this character with Force powers, or spend Force points to reroll attacks against this character or to respond to this character's attacks and abilities)
Yun-Ne'Shel Devotion (This character and each Yuuzhan Vong ally gets +4 to save rolls as long as it has another Yuuzhan Vong ally within 6 squares)

Commander Effect
Unique Allied Yuuzhan Vong gain Yun-Ne'Shel Devotion

"The Jedi revere life, as does Yun-Ne'Shel, the Modeler." -- Nom Anor, in his guise as the Prophet Yu'shaa

Swarms, with a million activations are annoying, as well. This is the reason the playgroup at my LGS, love playing 500 Epics Tourneys, because 16 activations are the max. IMHO, there should be some cap on activations in 200pt competition play. Thanks for hearing my plea

I think it's a little goofy to release pieces that lack proper playtesting, and then cry foul, when some one finds a way to use them. The same boys-club that makes these pieces complains that they're too good.
I've always said the answer is to make less pieces per set.
also, lack of playtesters is a problem.
I think designers should spend more time testing pieces, than dreaming up new, and complex abilities.

we should wait as long as we did to fix this issue as we did the Mouse Dumping NPE.
but then, the biggest offenders, were designers/on the balance committee.

we need more playtesting, not designs.

We have 36 pieces in the newest set - I think it's a fairly manageable number. I also think that design intent and play-testing has been a lot better in the last few sets - nothing has emerged as broken from set 10 or 11 that I've heard about yet, and a lot of the good pieces have been uniques. Play-testing wasn't quite as strong in the upcoming set as it was in the previous two sets, and a lot of the load was on Spry, Mando, and myself, but everything got a going over to some extent.

There's also a pretty big separation between the Balance Committee and Design Team - four members of the balance committee have never been designers (although Spry has worked on the upcoming Epic III set), and the other three are not current designers.

I definitely think that:
- there are a few pieces around that probably need addressing, especially Vong.
- the process is better than it was in terms of preventing broken pieces - there's more of a focus on making uniques and Jedis the best pieces in the set, and building up overlooked sub-factions.
- we need to step up playtesting next set a bit to keep up quality.

Thanks Jim for helping steer the game in a better direction. Your always a classy guy... even when dropping the mice.

My suggestions for the balance committee...

Yun-Ne'Shel Priest - make the save +2. (VCA 6 being lowered to VCA 2 is crazy.)

Warrior Caste Subcommander - re-cost to 22pts. (He gives out Blast Bugs!)

Domain Lah Warrior - re-cost to 14 points.
Games I've played opponents kill 5 or 6 of the 10pt Lah warriors and cant even reach 100pts for a 1 point loss.
14 points gives you 2 less warriors in the squad and 40 less unpreventable Blast Bug damage each round.

Thank you balance committee for hearing our concerns.

@10points two Domain Lah warriors are better than Tsavong Lah. Here's what a good non blast bug squad looks like...

Drop Tsavong Lah and Charging Subaltern for 8 domain Lah warriors and better tech. Give the Scouts and Yun-Ne'Shel Priest Aggressive Negotiations. Gain a bodyguard with avoid defeat 7. Gain Double & Scarification for warriors that hit +14 atk double/twin for 120 damage each.

--Lah warriors Vong--
30 Supreme Overlord Quorreal
28 Zenoc Quah
18 Praetorite Vong Priest
17 Yuuzhan Vong Subaltern
15 Yammosk War Coordinator
11 Yuuzhan Vong Ossus Protector
80 Domain Lah Warrior x8
Preferred Reinforcements:
(S. O. Quorreal) 13 Yun-Ne'Shel Priest
(S. O. Quorreal) 10 Zonoma Sekot Scout x2
(199pts. 17 activations)